Game of Thrones Spoiler Discussion

[The Good Doctor]

38 minutes ago, Celan said:

Like maybe the ritual we saw where the Night King was created, that was a Stark and he wasn't an unwilling participant, because they were trying to avert something even darker.

Didn’t the Children of the Forest make them as a weapon? I’d have to go back, but I think Leaf or the 3E Raven said that they created the Walkers to fight humanity. The simplest answer would be that the Night King is just fulfilling his original purpose to an extreme degree. Though that’s one of the less interesting possibilities, imo.

It also might be noteworthy that in the books, Melisandre tried to view “the enemy” in the Flames, and they showed her what seemed to be Bloodraven and Bran in a Weirwood tree.

And I don’t think it’s shadow that Mel fears, but the Long Night itself. You’d think they’d be similar, but she at least sees them as completely different. According to her, shadows are servants of light. But she could be unique in that viewpoint given that she’s a shadowbinder who seemingly went rogue from the Red Priesthood in her attempt to save the world. None of the others we’ve seen have made that distinction.

[The Good Doctor]

6 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said:

Ok but what could be worse than being turned into zombies?

We haven’t gotten their perspective yet. Maybe it’s fun. 

[BigBossBalrog]

Just now, The Good Doctor said:

We haven’t gotten their perspective yet. Maybe it’s fun. 

Looks like a pretty sweet deal to me

[Celan]

3 hours ago, The Good Doctor said:

Didn’t the Children of the Forest make them as a weapon? I’d have to go back, but I think Leaf or the 3E Raven said that they created the Walkers to fight humanity. The simplest answer would be that the Night King is just fulfilling his original purpose to an extreme degree. Though that’s one of the less interesting possibilities, imo.

It also might be noteworthy that in the books, Melisandre tried to view “the enemy” in the Flames, and they showed her what seemed to be Bloodraven and Bran in a Weirwood tree.

And I don’t think it’s shadow that Mel fears, but the Long Night itself. You’d think they’d be similar, but she at least sees them as completely different. According to her, shadows are servants of light. But she could be unique in that viewpoint given that she’s a shadowbinder who seemingly went rogue from the Red Priesthood in her attempt to save the world. None of the others we’ve seen have made that distinction.

But which humanity? The First Men and Children eventually banded together to stop the Andal invasion.

Mel does say that about shadows, but still not long before that talks about the Shadow. I'll have to find the place.

[The Good Doctor]

27 minutes ago, Celan said:

But which humanity? The First Men and Children eventually banded together to stop the Andal invasion.

That’s something that has me stumped.

In the books, the Children and the First Men made peace with each other thousands of years before the Long Night, which in turn occurred centuries or longer before the Andals arrived. It doesn’t make sense that the Children would have created the Others as a weapon; they were at peace with humanity.

So either the history and legends we know of are false and extremely unreliable, or the Children pretended to be humanity’s friends for thousands of years while plotting their demise (and the humans never found out), or the TV White Walkers have a different origin from the book ones.

No matter what, though, if the Others did start as a weapon for killing humans, it would’ve been the First Men, as the Andals wouldn’t arrive until much later. 

[Celan]

They made peace and the First Men spread the weirwoods, then made the White Walkers later to stem the invasion. I don't see any discrepancy there, what am I missing? They had to use magical means to stop the invasion elsewhere so it would make sense to me that that would be when they created the White Walkers.

[The Good Doctor]

2 hours ago, Celan said:

They made peace and the First Men spread the weirwoods, then made the White Walkers later to stem the invasion. I don't see any discrepancy there, what am I missing?

The White Walkers predate the invasion. That’s why the descendants of the First Men have lore on then but the Southerners don’t.

[Celan]

32 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said:

The White Walkers predate the invasion. That’s why the descendants of the First Men have lore on then but the Southerners don’t.

But they would if they helped create them? I dunno, it will be interesting to see what comes out of the prequel series. 

[The Good Doctor]

6 minutes ago, Celan said:

But they would if they helped create them? I dunno, it will be interesting to see what comes out of the prequel series. 

They could have helped create them. Though it would conflict with the flashback of the children doing it alone by sacrificing that human captive.

I think the Starks have something to do with it. Not sure if they had a hand in the Others’ creation or their defeat, but there’s something special about that family.

[Celan]

8 hours ago, The Good Doctor said:

They could have helped create them. Though it would conflict with the flashback of the children doing it alone by sacrificing that human captive.

I think the Starks have something to do with it. Not sure if they had a hand in the Others’ creation or their defeat, but there’s something special about that family.

Well my theory is the captive was a willing sacrifice, and was himself a Stark. Granted he looked terrified in the scene.

BTW not to harp on my Tyrion + Sansa wish, but I read this in Clash of Kings and I can't help but see what I'm talking about here.

"The new High Septon said that the gods will never permit Lord Stannis to win, since Joffrey is the rightful king."

A half smile flickered across the queen's face. "Robert's trueborn son and heir. Though Joff would cry whenever Robert picked him up. His Grace did not like that. His bastards had always gurgled at him happily, and sucked his finger when he put it in their little baseborn mouths. Robert wanted smiles and cheers, always, so he went where he found them, to his friends and his whores. Robert wanted to be loved. My brother Tyrion has the same disease. Do you want to be loved, Sansa?"

"Everyone wants to be loved."

"I see flowering hasn't made you any brighter," said Cersei. "Sansa, permit me to share a bit of womanly wisdom with you on this very special day. Love is poison. A sweet poison, but it will kill you all the same."

[Celan]

This comes after Sansa has stood on a platform with her father's body jerking at her feet, seen his head spiked alongside that of her guards and teacher, been stripped and beaten by the Kingsguard at Joffrey's command, was almost gang raped by a mob, and right before this scene, she found she had started her period and was so terrified of being forced to marry Joffrey that she tried to burn the bedding. So even though the show is trying to make her out to be all cold and bitchy, I can't hate her. She just wanted the good stories to be true. I'd like her and Tyrion to make a better story out of their own.

[ColonelKillaBee]

Bet you five bucks it ain’t happening 

[ColonelKillaBee]

Make it 20

[The Good Doctor]

4 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said:

Bet you five bucks it ain’t happening 

I’ll bet you $100 that there is a marriage between Tyrion and Sansa in the show. 

[ColonelKillaBee]

16 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said:

I’ll bet you $100 that there is a marriage between Tyrion and Sansa in the show. 

 

[ColonelKillaBee]

Aaaaalmost fell for it

[The Good Doctor]

It was worth a try.  

[Centurion]

[ColonelKillaBee]

 all are gold

[BigBossBalrog]

DEATH FLAGS DEATH FLAGS FUCKING EVERYWHERE!

[ColonelKillaBee]

Tormund had the most awkward boasting scene I’ve ever seen

[ColonelKillaBee]

Fuck Celan was right  

[BigBossBalrog]

Oh god what the fuck. WHAT THE FUCK 

[ColonelKillaBee]

I feel weird seeing Arya naked tho... hey grow up so fast.

[BigBossBalrog]

Tearing up a bit here  Jaimne and Brienne have come such a long way