Roleplayer's Off Topic Thread #32

[TheCzarsHussar]

5 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said:

I mean they mention in the intro that the Reds have been super charging their conscription and arming their armies with stolen weapons. So I find it very easy to handwave. The Nazis and the Rangers are still far better equipped and trained. 

With the amount of firepower being used to attack D6, to the point where in the non-canon ending the Rangers had to Allah-Akbar their own base to prevent it being used, the only reason I'd believe the Red Line had this power if they killed off the Reich.

Otherwise it brings up the question of why none of these munitions and t a n k s were used by the Red Line or even mentioned in 2033.

[BigBossBalrog]

Just now, TheCzarsHussar said:

With the amount of firepower being used to attack D6, to the point where in the non-canon ending the Rangers had to Allah-Akbar their own base to prevent it being used, the only reason I'd believe the Red Line had this power if they killed off the Reich.

Otherwise it brings up the question of why none of these munitions and t a n k s were used by the Red Line or even mentioned in 2033.

The Reich has Panzers. There's no reason why they couldn't have taken them or made there own by the time of Last Light.

https://metrovideogame.fandom.com/wiki/Panzer

[TheCzarsHussar]

Just now, BigBossBalrog said:

The Reich has Panzers. There's no reason why they couldn't have taken them or made there own by the time of Last Light.

https://metrovideogame.fandom.com/wiki/Panzer

Aye if they conquered the Reich's stations I'd believe it. Such a simple solution.

[TheCzarsHussar]

It's only been a single year between 2033 and 2034, if it's been twenty years since the nukes dropped and the Red Line was barely able to equip all it's soldiers. Then how do they suddenly have huge stockpiles of weapons and armored railcarts.

[The Good Doctor]

Just now, TheCzarsHussar said:

With the amount of firepower being used to attack D6, to the point where in the non-canon ending the Rangers had to Allah-Akbar their own base to prevent it being used, the only reason I'd believe the Red Line had this power if they killed off the Reich.

Otherwise it brings up the question of why none of these munitions and t a n k s were used by the Red Line or even mentioned in 2033.

Perhaps it’s a matter of world/game scale. I can’t remember which game says this, probably Exodus, but I’m pretty sure that there are tens of thousands of people living in the Metro. It could be like Bethesda games where towns and armies are canonically larger than the games can depict.

Last Light showing more impressive forces with more equipment could be a matter of the game having the ability to handle a larger scale than its predecessor.

Or not. LL did streamline the gameplay in a lot of ways, so I could easily see them just kinda ticking up the enemy strength as a way to make up for the player being stronger. It’s the kind of inconsistency that would ideally have an explanation, but sadly this is pretty common in game writing. 

[BigBossBalrog]

1 minute ago, TheCzarsHussar said:

It's only been a single year between 2033 and 2034, if it's been twenty years since the nukes dropped and the Red Line was barely able to equip all it's soldiers. Then how do they suddenly have huge stockpiles of weapons and armored railcarts.

There's literally two Redline railcarts in the entire game 

[TheCzarsHussar]

1 minute ago, BigBossBalrog said:

There's literally two Redline railcarts in the entire game 

I swear there was multiple tanks in their assault of D6, that and large swarms of well equipped soldiers. 

[BigBossBalrog]

1 minute ago, TheCzarsHussar said:

I swear there was multiple tanks in their assault of D6, that and large swarms of well equipped soldiers. 

Nah you just see one; and the other is from the attack on the Reich stronghold in the DLC. 

[TheCzarsHussar]

2 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said:

Perhaps it’s a matter of world/game scale. I can’t remember which game says this, probably Exodus, but I’m pretty sure that there are tens of thousands of people living in the Metro. It could be like Bethesda games where towns and armies are canonically larger than the games can depict.

You're correct on that front. Don't quote me on the source because I don't recall which game either but I know there's at least 15 thousand people in the Red Line stations.

3 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said:

Last Light showing more impressive forces with more equipment could be a matter of the game having the ability to handle a larger scale than its predecessor.

Or not. LL did streamline the gameplay in a lot of ways, so I could easily see them just kinda ticking up the enemy strength as a way to make up for the player being stronger. It’s the kind of inconsistency that would ideally have an explanation, but sadly this is pretty common in game writing. 

What made the Red Line so powerful was the sheer amount of manpower it could amass, the only way they could be outnumbered is if every/most of the habited station allied against them. The Reich is like three stations but their equipment is of really good quality, like their soldiers. The battles in the tunnels remind me of a warped ww1 style front, with minimal gain in land with (relative) huge losses for the attacking Red Line. There's no massive front lines here, only tight killing zones.

[BigBossBalrog]

Mind you, the final attack in D6 have has well-equipped soldiers, but there doesn't seem to be anymore then a hundred or so of them (and there only shown in that level and with Pavel). It just seemed to me they were sending in all of there elites to secure D6 cause it's so important. 

[TheCzarsHussar]

2 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said:

Nah you just see one; and the other is from the attack on the Reich stronghold in the DLC. 

In that case I'm even more annoyed!

By the time of LL, the Spartans are well established in D6. Not only are they of a similar if not superior skill to the Reich's rangers, but they should be far better equipped since they're sitting on a soviet/federation bunker. If the Red Line was unable to break the Reich in their one or two fronts, how the FUCK could they overwhelm the Spartan rangers?

[The Good Doctor]

11 minutes ago, TheCzarsHussar said:

I swear there was multiple tanks in their assault of D6, that and large swarms of well equipped soldiers. 

I can’t remember either way but for what it’s worth, if they only had five tanks in the entire Metro, there is a very good chance that they would be extremely cautious about ever deploying them. Not to mention transplanting a tank anywhere in the Metro would take a lot of effort and preparation, due to the dangerous and linear layout. 

If they had even just a few tanks, then it’s likely the long planned all-in assault on D6 would be the place where those would show up. As well as pretty much all the rest of their top notch goodies.

I’d take more issue with the strangely high quality of their footsoldiers’ gear throughout the rest of the game.

[BigBossBalrog]

Just now, TheCzarsHussar said:

In that case I'm even more annoyed!

By the time of LL, the Spartans are well established in D6. Not only are they of a similar if not superior skill to the Reich's rangers, but they should be far better equipped since they're sitting on a soviet/federation bunker. If the Red Line was unable to break the Reich in their one or two fronts, how the FUCK could they overwhelm the Spartan rangers?

They explain this in the game, go play it 

[TheCzarsHussar]

1 minute ago, BigBossBalrog said:

They explain this in the game, go play it 

 

[The Good Doctor]

2 minutes ago, TheCzarsHussar said:

If the Red Line was unable to break the Reich in their one or two fronts, how the FUCK could they overwhelm the Spartan rangers?

Aren’t the Rangers a small force even compared to the Reich? I imagine it’s something of a BoS vs NCR situation.

[TheCzarsHussar]

1 minute ago, The Good Doctor said:

Aren’t the Rangers a small force even compared to the Reich? I imagine it’s something of a BoS vs NCR situation.

Id equate it more of a NCR vs the Enclave oil rig without the chosen one blowing it up. Just without power armor and energy weapons

[BigBossBalrog]

The Rangers only have 100 active combat members. They can get fucked by a Russian Zerg rush that could be twenty times it's size at the least.

[The Good Doctor]

15 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said:

Mind you, the final attack in D6 have has well-equipped soldiers, but there doesn't seem to be anymore then a hundred or so of them (and there only shown in that level and with Pavel). It just seemed to me they were sending in all of there elites to secure D6 cause it's so important. 

This makes sense to me. The big assaults on D6 and the Reich are where I’d expect the Reds to bust out every tool at their disposal. Even the ones they have been holding onto for years.

But it seems like these sorts of elite and well-equipped soldiers are fairly common throughout the game. I’d say that is a legit issue to point out. 

6 minutes ago, TheCzarsHussar said:

Id equate it more of a NCR vs the Enclave oil rig without the chosen one blowing it up. Just without power armor and energy weapons

I dunno. NCR vs the rig sounds damn near hopeless as the rig is basically impenetrable without boats or vertibirds. Ten guys could probably keep the NCR out. At least D6 is approachable on foot.

Helios seems like an apt comparison. Overwhelmingly elite and well-equipped defenders holding an entrenched position against a never-ending horde of attackers. They can give a lot better than they’ll get, but they can’t hold out forever.

[TheCzarsHussar]

Just now, The Good Doctor said:

Helios seems like an apt comparison. Overwhelmingly elite and well-equipped defenders holding an entrenched position against a never-ending horde of attackers. They can give a lot better than they’ll get, but they can’t hold out forever.

Helios is very indefensible though, unlike D6. Hell it took serious effort to even discover D6, if the Rangers were able to I bet they could just keep the entrances on lockdown and bar the Reds completely. But then that turns into a siege.

[BigBossBalrog]

Just now, TheCzarsHussar said:

Helios is very indefensible though, unlike D6. Hell it took serious effort to even discover D6, if the Rangers were able to I bet they could just keep the entrances on lockdown and bar the Reds completely. But then that turns into a siege.

They literally break down the door with what amounts to a Russian battering ram; a large armored train hooked with explosives and jagged metal.  

[The Good Doctor]

1 minute ago, BigBossBalrog said:

The Rangers only have 100 active combat members

I didn’t know that. Dang. Yeah, in that case these guys needing a miracle is totally believable. Especially when we know that the Red Line is pretty merciless in its conscripting. A 15,000+ population can already field a decently sized army, but they would be dipping into that number quite a bit more than average. Commies gonna Commie.  

[TheCzarsHussar]

1 minute ago, BigBossBalrog said:

 

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They literally break down the door with what amounts to a Russian battering ram; a large armored train hooked with explosives and jagged metal.  

I hope this wasn't the main doors, ya know the kind meant to withstand a nuclear explosion sorta thing?

[BigBossBalrog]

1 minute ago, TheCzarsHussar said:

I hope this wasn't the main doors, ya know the kind meant to withstand a nuclear explosion sorta thing?

It isn't, it's the side tunnel, and the Reds use it to flank the rangers

[The Good Doctor]

I went back and watched a clip of the final battle and it does indeed seem to be a side door for trains.

Funnily enough, General Miller gives a speech in which he tries to encourage his Rangers by telling them that each is worth five Reds.  So like, you’re saying we’re all screwed then?

[The Good Doctor]

@TheCzarsHussar Have you played Dishonored? If not, you should. It’s another series with an incredibly rich world (it is almost suspicious how well developed it is just in the first game alone) that is unique and memorable.

Plus, most people here have played it, so there’s plenty of conversations to be had.