Celan Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 12 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said: Maybe you can explain to me the contradiction in me saying that the Courier has the potential to be a morally better person than House but not as likely to progress humanity or Vegas as much in the grand scheme. You’re just redefining what 'better' means, but you're still assuming you will do better than House. Like you said, you're 'calling dibs' on the entire city. In other words, you're still arguing that Yes Man is better. It's not like you're trying to argue that you don't care if it's better, you still won't be House's bitch, or some such logic. Which honestly I'm guessing plays a role for a lot of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 6 minutes ago, Celan said: You’re just redefining what 'better' means, but you're still assuming you will do better than House. Like you said, you're still 'calling dibs' on the entire city. How’s he assuming he’ll do better than house by stating he won’t likely have progressed humanity as far as him? He said he’s assuming he’ll be morally better than house. Stating that you will be better than someone at one thing, something that is very much in your control as well (morality), while doing worse in another category ain’t a contradiction. And it’s pretty easy to be better than house in the case of morality. Just don’t murder a whole group of civies for making peace with the people you want to trade with. 1 "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 7 minutes ago, Celan said: You’re just redefining what 'better' means, but you're still assuming you will do better than House. Like you said, you're still 'calling dibs' on the entire city. I said “better” based on my own values. Even if the Courier does a worse job than House in every area of leadership, but doesn’t wipe out good people who he has a petty problem with, then I consider him a better person. You’re a bigger picture person than me. That’s fine. But I’m not willing to overlook the willful slaughter of innocents to achieve a greater good. 1 * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 4 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said: But I’m not willing to overlook the willful slaughter of innocents to achieve a greater good. Not when an acceptable alternative is present, in my case and there isn’t a real need or gain from it. For me, accepting a negative for the greater good is only acceptable when the negative is to meet an end. Defending a negative that is completely unnecessary like that because of other benefits however is not justifiable in my eyes. I was more hesitant to choose Yes Man before until after I played Old World Blues. I don’t need to bring people to the moon, improving life on earth with the technical marvels I discover is rather Tesla esque And works for me. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 As for “calling dibs”, the ending slide (which is clearly being cheeky) states hat the Courier calls dibs on shapin the Mojave, not necessarily on Vegas as a self-styled dictator. And that applies to all Couriers. Not just mine. They are the deciding factor in who wins Hoover Dam regardless of whether they take charge of Vegas afterwards or not. * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celan Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 5 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said: Not when an acceptable alternative is present, in my case and there isn’t a real need or gain from it. For me, accepting a negative for the greater good is only acceptable when the negative is to meet an end. Defending a negative that is completely unnecessary like that because of other benefits however is not justifiable in my eyes. Well I do see a negative. Potentially a very big one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 Just now, Celan said: Well I do see a negative. Potentially a very big one. If you’re talking about the Yes Man ending, as do we which we’ve already mentioned the possibility of. But that is entirely dependent on your courier what sort of negative that is and how great. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celan Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 And you said House was accepting a negative for no gain. Which it is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 Just now, Celan said: And you said House was accepting a negative for no gain. Which it is not. What gain is there from trying to force out the Kings and then killing them? * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCzarsHussar Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 My truly favorite ending is the Endless Argument one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celan Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 1 minute ago, The Good Doctor said: What gain is there from trying to force out the Kings and then killing them? Having House minding the store. The one who saved the city in rather miraculous fashion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, Celan said: And you said House was accepting a negative for no gain. Which it is not. No, I said you were. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 Just now, Celan said: Having House minding the store. The one who saved the city in rather miraculous fashion. That isn’t a negative for a positive. Not a means to an end. That is a positive in spite of a negative. There was no reason to kill the kings but you accept that negative because of what is an overwhelming positive in your eyes. That’s not only not justifiable it’s not at all libertarian. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celan Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said: No, I said you were. I was what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 Just now, Celan said: I was what? See above. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celan Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, Celan said: I was what? It certainly is justifiable and we likely don't agree on what libertarian means. And like I said earlier, it's not even a hard choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 Just now, Celan said: It certainly is justifiable and we likely don't agree on what libertarian means. Certainly not what you’ve described here in this conversation. If it’s ok to stomp out the life and freedom of others for a greater good even when the action is not necessary to achieve said greater good, then you can keep it. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCzarsHussar Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 What's the longest argument you guys ever had? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBossBalrog Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 This is honestly how I view the New Vegas fans who spend all day trying to convince me that i'm a bad person by doing a routine job i've done a thousand times before. The Courier had NOOOOOOOOO idea he was carrying a doomsday device. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 4 minutes ago, TheCzarsHussar said: What's the longest argument you guys ever had? The civil war. And it’s a debate lol. I’ll take long winded debates over long periods of nothing but memes to break up the silence 1 "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celan Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 10 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said: This is honestly how I view the New Vegas fans who spend all day trying to convince me that i'm a bad person by doing a routine job i've done a thousand times before. The Courier had NOOOOOOOOO idea he was carrying a doomsday device. And you’re not supposed to be affected by what happened at all? Okay. I find that boring. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Celan said: Having House minding the store. The one who saved the city in rather miraculous fashion. House’s store is the Strip. If he wanted to rule Freeside too, he should have staked his claim when he retook the city. He’s ignored them for years allowed them to develop their own community, which starts to shape up somewhat with the Courier’s help. Personally, I don’t think that saving the city, miraculous as it was, is enough to make everyone in it subject to his ultimate will. Maybe in th Strip where he worked hard to build a community, but he hasn’t done a thing for Outer Vegas since he stopped the nukes. * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Centurion Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 It seemed like y’all have flip flopped on the same type of action between game universes. Like earlier it was an argument on the acceptability of kicking the orcs out without killing them for their ores and Colonel was for this whole Celan was staunchly against, no way, no how. And now it’s eh a group of Elvis cosplayers who help a downtrodden community the House gives no shits about gets slaughtered because they don’t want to leave their home after making peace with a group that House invites so he can keep his power. Celan = Perfect. Colonel and Doc = nah fam. not saying you have to be consistent across universes, but the staunch opposition across both situations is a direct contradiction of character lol. Oh and I stand with not killing the Kings on this argument Fuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBossBalrog Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Celan said: And you’re not supposed to be affected by what happened at all? Okay. I find that boring. I'm not going to grovel and beg at House's feet for forgiveness. Step up. Admit you had somewhat of a hand in it, say to yourself that your going to do better this time, and don't let the shackles of the past effect you. Because it ultimately wasn't your fault. You're fighting for the future, not the past. You don't own House nuthin. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, Celan said: And you’re not supposed to be affected by what happened at all? Okay. I find that boring. I agree with this completely. If I chose to deliver a package that got hundreds or thousands of people killed, I’d feel like shit. Especially considering the Courier seeming chose to carry that specific package because of his/her familiarity with the Divide and the Old World flag being fascinating. * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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