ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 56 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said: And I enjoy the Thalmor as a villain. I don’t see your point. There aren’t any Legion apologists here. I never said I don't enjoy having them around to shoot lol, they make good villains indeed. I'm just sayin fuck em. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Besides, their success is totally dependent on the survival of one man. After Caesar is killed, their time is limited and the tribal morons will turn on themselves and die. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Just now, ColonelKillaBee said: I never said I don't enjoy having them around to shoot lol, they make good villains indeed. I'm just sayin fuck em. You said that calling them badass sounded like Confederate apology, which is what I disagreed with. Everyone probably agrees fuck the Legion. It's always nice when your writing gets reinforced by the canon after you come up with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Beyond that, and that they're a bunch of raping slavers, I'll never respect anyone that looks like they came straight out of Dick's Sporting Goods. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 56 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said: You said that calling them badass sounded like Confederate apology, which is what I disagreed with. Everyone probably agrees fuck the Legion. Fuck the legion means fuck everything about them and what they stand for lol, not fuck you tho I gotta admit I like the cut of your jib, lol. When I say fuck em, I mean fuck em. Raping slavers are not badass. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBossBalrog Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said: Fuck the legion means fuck everything about them and what they stand for lol, not fuck you tho I gotta admit I like the cut of your jib, lol. When I say fuck em, I mean fuck em. Raping slavers are not badass. Vikings we're raping slavers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 56 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said: Vikings we're raping slavers. As was pretty much everyone back then. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Just now, ColonelKillaBee said: Besides, their success is totally dependent on the survival of one man. After Caesar is killed, their time is limited and the tribal morons will turn on themselves and die. Same goes for most factions. The NCR is one of the only groups in Fallout that’s immune to this. 1 minute ago, ColonelKillaBee said: When I say fuck em, I mean fuck em. Raping slavers are not badass. Rollo was pretty badass. Hate them all you want. I doubt you hate their philosophy and ways any more than I do. But being a terrible person is completely unrelated to how badass you are. Elijah was a genocidal maniac who also enslaved people. But I also think the shit he pulled at the Big Empty was really damn impressive. It's always nice when your writing gets reinforced by the canon after you come up with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Just now, ColonelKillaBee said: As was pretty much everyone back then. The also applies to large swaths of the wasteland. Especially Arizona where the Legion originates from. The shit we saw from the White Legs was implied to basically be the norm back in the day. It's always nice when your writing gets reinforced by the canon after you come up with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celan Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 29 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said: He honestly annoyed me, he's fucking like "You kill up close, you're a fucking savage" and i'm just like "Bitch! You beat people to death with a fucking flag pole! You use melee too!" He makes a comment based on your highest stat, right? His deal is to get you to confront yourself and the consequences of your actions. He's a very Chris Avellone character. Durance in Pillars is like that, too. I can't see the Roman cosplayers as badass no matter what, though. The NCR is inept in the Mojave because they're overstretched and bound by certain ethics the legion dispenses with- they don't generally engage in total war. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBossBalrog Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Just now, The Good Doctor said: The also applies to large swaths of the wasteland. Especially Arizona where the Legion originates from. The shit we saw from the White Legs was implied to basically be the norm back in the day. I think people sometimes forget about 99.99 percent of the Legion is tribals...whose society has devolved to a more primitive state. I'm not saying it's all right, cause it fucking aint, but the stuff the Legion does is culturally ingrained into there heads. Like the Vikings and the Romans... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 56 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said: Same goes for most factions. The NCR is one of the only groups in Fallout that’s immune to this. Rollo was pretty badass. Hate them all you want. I doubt you hate their philosophy and ways any more than I do. But being a terrible person is completely unrelated to how badass you are. Elijah was a genocidal maniac who also enslaved people. But I also think the shit he pulled at the Big Empty was really damn impressive. I beg to differ on the philosophy bit, since it's a lot more personal to me, so admittedly I'm biased. But there's a big difference between a faction that on occasion does awful things that were normal for the time period, vs a faction made by a man that knows better and chooses to make a group centered around enslaving and raping for survival. So I'm not budging on that, fuck each and every one of em. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 1 hour ago, The Good Doctor said: The also applies to large swaths of the wasteland. Especially Arizona where the Legion originates from. The shit we saw from the White Legs was implied to basically be the norm back in the day. Large swaths, but not all of them. And even if it's post apocalypse, there are those around that still remember what it means to be decent. For me, the badass ones are those that fight to preserve that and protect others, not the ones that revert to a time long past. It's not the same situation "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBossBalrog Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 This actually reminds me of me thinking about Rome when I rewatched it a few months ago...is the cultural disconnect. Titus brags about fucking raping Gauls in one of the episode. Vurreno wants to become a slave trader, and has a large amount of slaves he wants to sell, and freely abuses his wife. All these things were accepted, and widely done, by Roman soldiers. Yet these characters are still portrayed as sympathetic...and received as sympathetic. It's kinda weird, it's a cultural disconnect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Just now, ColonelKillaBee said: I beg to differ on the philosophy bit, since it's a lot more personal to me, so admittedly I'm biased Maybe it’s personal to me too. I love you man but if you think there is a fiber of my being that doesn’t hate rape, murder, and slavery, you’re wrong. You can’t measure hatred of evil that easily. 1 minute ago, ColonelKillaBee said: Large swaths, but not all of them. And even if it's post apocalypse, there are those around that still remember what it means to be decent. For me, the badass ones are those that fight to preserve that and protect others, not the ones that revert to a time long past. It's not the same situation Obviously not all of them. But the parts of Arizona, New Mexico, Colorado, and Utah that most of the Legion comes from were hell. That’s why he was able to make it work at all. I’m not even saying that the Legion made those areas better. I’m saying that the tribals who got absorbed into it came from cultures where that stuff was every bit as “normal for their time period” as it was for the Vikings. For me, those are the good and moral ones you’re describing. And yeah, they’re badass too. So is Elijah, who again, commits almost all the same atrocities as the Legion on a smaller scale and is planning to kill thousands on a larger one for even worse reasons. He’s no better than Lanius or Caesar. The only difference is that he failed before he could affect the world on a similar scale. It's always nice when your writing gets reinforced by the canon after you come up with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 56 minutes ago, BigBossBalrog said: This actually reminds me of me thinking about Rome when I rewatched it a few months ago...is the cultural disconnect. Titus brags about fucking raping Gauls in one of the episode. Vurreno wants to become a slave trader, and has a large amount of slaves he wants to sell, and freely abuses his wife. All these things were accepted, and widely done, by Roman soldiers. Yet these characters are still portrayed as sympathetic...and received as sympathetic. It's kinda weird, it's a cultural disconnect. So if someone decided to cosplay the Nazis in the post apocalypse and were widely successful in their exploits you'd give them a pass too? Listen, I get the arguments made, you're trying to disconnect the action from what they stand for and why they're doing what they do. I can't. If a man charges twenty guys alone and kills them all by himself, is the feat impressive, sure, but the reason for it, for me, matters. If he did that to protect a group of civilians, definitely badass. If he did that so his men could get to civilians to terrorize, not so badass. Perfect example, Al Qaeda and ISIS, monsters. Their soldiers often do all kinds of crazy shit that supporters of might call "driven" or their men "disciplined and dedicated", etc. But from our perspective they're just a bunch of shitheads whose religion and doctrine either is used as an excuse to kill, or, has collectively made them insane, among a bunch of other factors. Same with the confederates and for instance, the Alamo. People loooove to glorify that shit but conveniently leave out that all started over Mexico's outlawing slavery in their territory upon gaining independence while it was still going strong here in the US, and the Texas revolutionists fighting against the Mexican govt were trying to establish a free state where slavery was legal. So yea, Fuck the Alamo. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 56 minutes ago, The Good Doctor said: Maybe it’s personal to me too. I love you man but if you think there is a fiber of my being that doesn’t hate rape, murder, and slavery, you’re wrong. You can’t measure hatred of evil that easily. Obviously not all of them. But the parts of Arizona, New Mexico, Colorado, and Utah that most of the Legion comes from were hell. That’s why he was able to make it work at all. I’m not even saying that the Legion made those areas better. I’m saying that the tribals who got absorbed into it came from cultures where that stuff was every bit as “normal for their time period” as it was for the Vikings. For me, those are the good and moral ones you’re describing. And yeah, they’re badass too. So is Elijah, who again, commits almost all the same atrocities as the Legion on a smaller scale and is planning to kill thousands on a larger one for even worse reasons. He’s no better than Lanius or Caesar. The only difference is that he failed before he could affect the world on a similar scale. I'm not saying you don't hate it, I'm saying the topic is more personal for me. The Vikings did not make slavery crucial for their existence. It was something that happened and something some even enjoyed but it wasn't central to their culture or what they were. It was simply an awful thing that happened prior to the morality of modern times. But what happens here in this world is everyone when facing the hardships of the apocalyptic world makes a choice. And yes, many make the wrong choice, but it's a choice nonetheless, and the legion was formed by a man who made the wrong choice, found others like him and forcefully overtook these people who may or may not have already been like this. Not all of the tribals were like the white legs after all. Some of them only know one way to live like the vikings, yes, but that isn't true for all of them, wasn't true for the man who made them, wasn't true for those they forcefully absorbed. Because of that I can never compare them. They're not the same, in my opinion. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTC Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 5 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said: People loooove to glorify that shit but conveniently leave out that all started over Mexico's outlawing slavery in their territory upon gaining independence while it was still going strong here in the US, and the Texas revolutionists fighting against the Mexican govt were trying to establish a free state where slavery was legal. So yea, Fuck the Alamo. lol there’s a bigoted and racist group I made up in Texas for the Fallout roleplay literally called the Alamo cult for this very reason. They hate ghouls, mutants, and Mexicans, and believe a twisted version of history where Santa Anna was ghoul as well as a Mexican. I figured not all racism would be gone in the Fallout world. Or in this case, that it might come back 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCzarsHussar Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Did I forget to mention Nick is genuinely a Legion fan? Finally finished my math homework not too long ago, thank god....until I learned I need to complete four more lessons before sunday. F u C k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBossBalrog Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Just now, TheCzarsHussar said: Did I forget to mention Nick is genuinely a Legion fan? I can tell. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 56 minutes ago, TheCzarsHussar said: Did I forget to mention Nick is genuinely a Legion fan? Not surprised at all tbh. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCzarsHussar Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 10 minutes ago, BTC said: lol there’s a bigoted and racist group I made up in Texas for the Fallout roleplay literally called the Alamo cult for this very reason. They hate ghouls, mutants, and Mexicans, and believe a twisted version of history where Santa Anna was ghoul as well as a Mexican. I figured not all racism would be gone in the Fallout world. Or in this case, that it might come back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 19 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said: I'm not saying you don't hate it, I'm saying the topic is more personal for me. And I’m saying that we have no idea if this is actually true. 19 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said: The Vikings did not make slavery crucial for their existence. It was something that happened and something some even enjoyed but it wasn't central to their culture or what they were. It was simply an awful thing that happened prior to the morality of modern times. The Legion don’t have a government like the various Norse groups did. They’re an army looking to conquer a territory. A more apt comparison to Legionaries would be Viking raiders, who thrived on awful shit. 19 minutes ago, ColonelKillaBee said: But what happens here in this world is everyone when facing the hardships of the apocalyptic world makes a choice. And yes, many make the wrong choice, but it's a choice nonetheless, and the legion was formed by a man who made the wrong choice, found others like him and forcefully overtook these people who may or may not have already been like this. Not all of the tribals were like the white legs after all. This seems like an oversimplied way of viewing the world. A tribal raider doesn’t just wake up and make a choice to be or not to be a tribal raider. He came from generations of that in a world where all his people know is raiding. Caesar is a horrible man who made the wrong choice, yeah of course. I’m not defending him. But he didn’t just go and recruit a bunch of others like him to do nasty things. He took over primitive tribes who couldn’t even conceive of something like the NCR. And there is no indication in the game that any of the tribes he conquered were especially different. Non-tribal wasteland communities were generally left alone or killed/enslaved if they became trouble because indoctrinating people with a somewhat modern worldview is much more difficult. And I still don’t see how Elijah is any better. He comes from an advanced society that doesn’t like slavery and has had decades of close contact with the NCR. Like Caesar, he knew the modern rules and did lots of horrible shit in spite of them. It's always nice when your writing gets reinforced by the canon after you come up with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKillaBee Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 You may not but I'm pretty damn sure. "I dont see how Elijah is better." Me neither, lol. Never said he was, though he only really started going off the deep end in the Sierra Madre. Anywho I'm gonna leave it as an agree to disagree. "Even the hardest dick must go flaccid." -Colonelkillabee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Good Doctor Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 Just now, ColonelKillaBee said: You may not but I'm pretty damn sure. Frankly, I don’t care how sure you think you are. I consider you a good friend, but you don’t know me well enough to say that. It's always nice when your writing gets reinforced by the canon after you come up with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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